So two weeks ago i wrote @Pirate3DPrinters a quick email, asking them what the patents they’re claiming are actually covering. To this day, i haven’t received an answer, which means one of two things:
What are your experiences with @Pirate3DPrinters ?
Lol filament that’s not their own…so all filament is free then.
As once I’ve bought it its mine.
Or do they really mean using non endorsed products will void your warranty.
…which, under european legislation, would be an illegal business practice (if the 2D printer legislation is somewhat transferable here).
Wow who in their right mind would send these hacks money???
No slight intended to members of the Hacker / Maker Community.
Wow… and their filament cartridges are $90.00 for 400g at pre-order prices
@Robert_Wozniak in defense of Pirate3D, that price is for a bundle of five cartridges.
Opps…Sorry, I missed that
Ahhh… yes the Epson marketing model.
Not my favorite model.
They might have done a design patent on their printer aesthetics. Really a pointless claim since they had those out like candy.
@Thomas_Sanladerer not illegal under US law, and only marginally illegal under EU law, although this varies a little by country. Technically speaking if your use of alternate filament damages the printer, your warranty is void. They just have to prove that it actually is the fault if the filament and they should honor the warranty if the problem is unrelated. Standards of proof are effectively highly skewed to the seller, though.
@Jasper_Janssen in the UK the printer must be fit for purpose. So it should be able to use any PLA.
Its like buying a car and you can only buy fuel from one garage in Iceland. Yet you sell your product world wide. Yet fuel of a better grade is available everywhere… Its unfair trading.
Just look a Microsoft and the browser case.
Yeah, that’s not actually true. Microsoft’s browser case hinges on the fact that they had a virtual monopoly on PC operating software, otherwise they’d have been allowed to do that no problem.
It’s like selling cars that run on only premium gasoline — perfectly legit.
@Jasper_Janssen its more accurate than what you claim.
And any car that runs on premium will run on less octane. So it not the same.
Microsoft claimed that their browser was the only one you could use to the point of stopping other browsers from working correctly
“And any car that runs on premium will run on less octane. So it not the same.”
Again, that is not actually true. The reverse is.
And microsoft claimed nothing of the sort, I suggest you read up on the actual history of those cases.
@Jasper_Janssen sorry seems you don’t get it. 101 octane and 98 octane do the same job one just produces a little more power and heat.
Microsoft didn’t claim the actually stopped other browsers from being the main browser.
All in all under EU law you must provide a clear and positive argument that stops you from sourcing alternative products.
Its that simple.
Seriously, go read up on octane. It is not about “more power and heat”, it doesn’t provide that for a given engine.
You know what, fuck it, you obviously can’t access wikipedia for some odd reason, so I’ll give you the cliff notes: You know how four stroke engines work, presumably? Suck-squeeze-bang-blow? If you squeeze too hard, the mixture will detonate before the spark comes from the spark plug. When that happens it is called “engine knocking” and depending on how severe it is it either lessens your performance (because some of the fuel is being used to work against the engine) or actually damages your engine.
An engine designed to run on low-octane fuel has compression that does not go over that limit when used with low octane fuel. Using high octane fuel does not give extra power. An engine that is designed for high octane fuel, however, has a higher compression ratio, designed to not go over that limit when used with high octane fuel, and will have slightly more power for a given cylinder size because it can basically put more fuel and air into each stroke. Running that engine on low-octane fuel, however, will (/may) cause knocking, which can kill your engine.
Your understanding of the microsoft case is similarly confused.
Some engines, like those in today’s sports cars, need high-octane fuel to perform or they will start knocking.
The comparison would be applicable if the P3D filament was, in fact, superior to what the premium suppliers sell, or proprietary in any way. But it’s not.
I’ve seen that non-OEM legislation in two places: One is printer ink, where non-OEM won’t impact your warranty, the other is car service, where you can go to any repair shop for routine maintenance and still be eligible for the mfg’s warranty (ATU even advertises with that). This is Germany, though, and the situation might be a bit different in other european countries.
Lol your both wrong about fuel. All it takes is a change in the injectors programming.
Remember the same was said of removing lead from fuel.
At the end of the day refusing to allow a 3d printer to run other filament is actually stopping you from using the printer for it purpose.
I know there is already a printer on the market that you can only use their filament and they use a chip ID to set temperature and feed rate.
But I cannot remember who makes it…that is a legal system.
@Thomas_Sanladerer Yup, europe has gotten a lot better about that – I still remember a time where manufacturer’s warranties did not routinely survive things like that, both for printers and cars, in .nl at least.
The USA has by comparison practically zero consumer protection. Basically, unless you’re doing false advertising you’re in the clear with all sorts of restrictions.
Like I said, though, if pirate3d can prove with a preponderance of the evidence that your use of third party filament caused the damage, they’re off the hook for repair even in europe (and not unreasonably, really!). So if the damage is clogged nozzles or a PLA buildup or anything along those lines, I wouldn’t count on warranty replacement of the extruder.
@Nigel_Dickinson Jesus, are really still holding on to your fiction? And you’re compounding the stupidity with the lead thing.
Here’s a hint: running an engine designed for leaded fuel on unleaded without a replacement additive will kill most of them quite quickly – the valve seats erode, you will lose compression, and you will need to have the head rebuilt. The salient point there is “designed for leaded fuel”. It’s perfectly possible to design engines for unleaded fuel, obviously – but running the wrong kind of fuel on the wrong kind of engine will fuck it up good. Seriously, just google it.
You have some decent points about pirate3d and filament but your examples are just fucked up beyond belief.